Author Topic: Goalkeeper teleporting bug  (Read 798 times)

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Offline pipo

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Goalkeeper teleporting bug
« on: 09 July 2018, 02:38:21 »
Hi guys,

I've had a look (via the search feature) on this forum for anyone talking about the goalkeeper teleporting bug.

To clarify, this is of course when a goalie suddenly obtains the ability to go from A to B (usually to save a shot) without actually having to use his legs! He suddenly just appears where he needs to be in order to save the goal.

Anyway - I had a look through the forum (a couple of rather old posts mentioned it) and online in general (via google) but has anyone (else) actually identified why this happens?

I'm quite old now (42!) and had the joy of playing SWOS when it was new and amazing (it's still amazing, just not as new!).

The bug is caused when any goalkeeper has a value over 3M. Or 3.000.000 or 3,000,000 or whatever way you want to write it (depending on where you live!).

Simply put, a goalie with a value equal to or less than 3 million cannot teleport. A keeper with a value higher than that can teleport (and it's bloody silly let's be honest!).

I played SWOS on the Amiga when I was a kid, and it was after an update (can't remember if it was official or not) which gave the then-Manchester United goalkeeper a value of, I believe, 4.5 million. So he was the only one who could teleport in that version of the game.

I wonder can this be addressed in the saved game data? Is there a way of reducing all goalkeepers who have a value > 3 million down to 3 million?

cheers, Phil (and thanks again for all the amazing work that went into the update for 16/17 - you are all heros in my eyes!!)
When SWOS was young, I was young too.

Now we've both matured!

Offline Playaveli

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Re: Goalkeeper teleporting bug
« Reply #1 on: 09 July 2018, 03:28:58 »
Our member Cofresi found this bug, as well. Only De Gea was affected, with a price tag of 8M.
Since you posted it now, too, I had another review on this issue. Turns out that goalkeepers above 4.5 M are effected by this problem.

Explanation:
Goalkeeper skills are not visible, but only are demonstrated by their reaction time and jumping-to-the-ball speed. The game calculates the probability of a goalkeeper to catch or save a shot. If the "skill" (or rather value) of the GK is too high, frames cannot catch up with his reaction time on pitch, thus resulting in him to teleport rather than jumping frame by frame.

On a second thought, it makes also sense that the most expensive (and therefore "skilled") GK in the original 96/97 are Schmeichel (Man U), Lama and Seaman (France & England national team). They must have seen this bug in the making and just eliminated it by limiting keeper prices (or rather skills) to 4.5M.

For future updates, we'll just go with a max. GK price of 4.5M!

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Offline Cofresi

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Re: Goalkeeper teleporting bug
« Reply #2 on: 09 July 2018, 20:17:22 »
 ;D good to see this has been noted, and is being resolved.

Offline pipo

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Re: Goalkeeper teleporting bug
« Reply #3 on: 09 July 2018, 20:50:59 »
Hi Playaveli!

Thanks for your reply  :)

It's interesting what you say about the frame rates not being able to keep up with the goalkeeper's reaction time on the pitch - I wonder was the frame rate different in terms of Amiga 500+ versus Amiga 1200?

I'm not 100% sure since it was 20 years ago (more probably!) that the update arrived, but I could have sworn that £3 million was the maximum value of a goalkeeper before the teleporting bug would "appear" (out of nowhere...just like the goalkeeper himself  ;D ).

I only ever used an Amiga 500+ for my SWOS years, so I'm wondering perhaps did the bug make it through the testing phase because they only tested on an Amiga 1200 (which may have had a faster frame rate than the 500+) and hence only poor guys like me with a mere 500+ had to suffer with magical goalkeepers! My solution at the time was to buy whichever goalkeeper was causing the problem (there might have been more than one, but as far as I remember there was only one in the English league) and then sell him to another club where he'd end up as a substitute goalkeeper and so he'd never cause me any problems again!).

Anyway, the amount isn't important, and I can check it some day as I still have all my old Amiga hardware in a rented garage (along with an even more ancient Opel Astra from 1991!!) in Nice in France.

The funny thing with the teleporting bug was that if the maximum "safe" value was (let's assume you're right) £4.5 million, then if you bought a goalkeeper for that amount and he increased in value during the season, the teleporting bug would not happen. His original value had to be above the "bug" threshold.

The dumb thing with the teleporting was that sometimes the goalie will actually teleport out of the way (by moving from his line to the edge of the box) and then scoring would be easy even for your grandmother!

Anyway, good idea to keep future updates within the non-teleporting limits. Danke!!

Does this bug also occur on the PC version of the game do you know?

==

Hi Cofresi!

I was just glad to know that I wasn't the only one getting this bug! I thought way back in 1997 that it had something to do with a glass of water that I spilled over my Amiga one day, but when I saw it happening in this version of the game, I realised that the Amiga was stronger than that glass of water after all :)
When SWOS was young, I was young too.

Now we've both matured!

Offline Playaveli

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Re: Goalkeeper teleporting bug
« Reply #4 on: 10 July 2018, 00:59:06 »
Amiga SWOS/Sensible Soccer versions runs at 50hz or 50 frames per second. On all Amiga models (500, 600, 1200 whatsoever).

I think memory is playing tricks on you, since 4.5M is the prize limit before this bug seems to appear. Not 3M, as you said.
Also, a 4.5M keeper does never increase his value in the first season. You have to wait a long time in a career until he goes up to 5M. But that doesn't increases his skills.  Example: An attacker scores a bunch of goals and raises his money value dramatically, still his skills always stay the same. He doesn't run faster or shoot harder... Got it? You have to differentiate there!

Bug also occurs on PC DOS version of the game, but in a slightly different manner. Yet, it's there!

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Offline pipo

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Re: Goalkeeper teleporting bug
« Reply #5 on: 10 July 2018, 23:36:52 »
"I think memory is playing tricks on you..."

After more than 20 years, I'm sure you're right  ;)

I might be remembering 3M as a max goalkeeper value in a different version of Sensible Soccer (possibly in the pre-SWOS days as I did have a few versions of the game), and nothing to do with the teleporting issue at all. Or as you say, I might just be re-inventing the past...I remember I was quite good on goal myself and maybe I just remember thinking "Hey, I must be worth £3 million" after playing real football with my friends and then five minutes later "Hey let's play SWOS!" and hence my memories are intermingled!

I've spent the last few days playing as a coach for AFC Wimbledon (an amazing real-life story in football that you may or may not know) and it became a bit of an obsession! The 16/17 update is truly fantastic and I thank you most sincerely for the efforts of you and your small but mighty army!

Now back to coding (I'm a programmer). It'd be cool to see the source code for SWOS some time, although I don't code in Assembler I did give it a try way back in 1996 when I still used my Commodore 64 (which I still have too!). If I can ever be of any use with 20 years of coding experience, I'd always be happy to do my bit around here :)

cheers, Phil
When SWOS was young, I was young too.

Now we've both matured!